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Military Orders Today

Elfríki

Elfríki

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So, as has been clear for a bit of a while now with my recent RP, and I guess this primarily aligns with my original nation concept, which was a modern crusader state... What do you guys have on Military Orders?

I've got a number of them, mainly based on Kristbjarg and probably Zalonarus, as you've probably seen in some of my RP in Matambaland. But the big one I've been fleshing out a bit (and by a bit I mean just three posts lol) is, of course, everyone's favorite, the OG, the Knights Templar.

The posts in question:
Elfríki

Post in thread 'Road to Kambaro'

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September, 1975
The Corridor, Kambaro

Gústavsson snapped a shot at the Grettir. Between the blue Jerusalem Cross and crimson St. Julian’s Cross, it was understandable why some people were looking at it with confused eyes.

It was a tank on wheels, and yet it had signs of the White Christ. Adding to the confusion was the pair of St. Julian’s Hospitallers standing by with assault rifles.

Only in the Federation would it make sense for such a thing, even as the Church in the wider world grew soft. They only turned the other cheek, though...
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Elfríki

Post in thread 'TruthWar - The Lies of the Global Elite Exposed'

THE CRUSADE AND THE CASH
Alexei Ivanovich
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The fortified exterior of the Monastery of Saint Paul of Pattabakki, near Pattabakki, on Kristbjarg. Photo © Saint Asvard’s Cathedral of Krossgarður.​

_____________________________

What is the key distinction, if any, between a Kristbjarger Banker and a Templar Brother?

You might say, “Well one wears a suit, over which he hangs a bear sash with a big fat gold brooch like his northern Elfric kin, while the other wears a red cross on his...
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Elfríki

Post in thread 'FotoGramo'

Poor Fellow-Soldiers of Christ and of the Temple of Solomon
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@KnightsTemplarOfficial
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Liked by @StJuliansHospitallersOfficial, @JarlStPetersSword, and 11,228 others

On this day, in the Year of Our Lord 1305, Hugh IV, King of the Francien, died peacefully in his sleep in the hours between midnight and sunrise.

His internment in the Basilica of St Denis and tomb furnishings were commissioned by Templar Grand Master...
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At first, I figured they'd be on Kristbjarg as with my other 'Crusader Orders', but then as you can tell from later posts, it's probably more like... they're everywhere that's Christian and possessing a healthy banking sector (thanks, Mount Solomon).

So more recently, I've been thinking (and you've probably seen this on the server), maybe, depending on who runs the Holy Land (Pelasgia, Radillo, an NPC, Kougi, etc), and depending on how the Crusades turned out after the tenth one, maybe they could still be in Jerusalem. And have Provinces in other cities with major financial districts. They would recruit from any Catholic (presumably) population.

Maybe they've even taken up the role of a Swiss Guard analogue and more, with a Province specifically for Tibur, and the Pope has his own Tier-1 special ops team to dispatch for whatever reason.

So yeah, that's what I've got baking so far.

Three points then:
1) Thoughts on this so far?
2) What are the odds that you have a Templar Province in your nation?
3) Do you have any of your own homegrown Military Orders?
 
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1) Thirding the badass

2) Likely would have established itself in Serbovia in some form, then banned by the SocNats after their takeover. The motives for the ban would be the SocNat nationalization of the banks, as well as lingering suspicion about the group being seen as a transnational, and militarized, movement beyond the control of the Party.

Figuring how this factors into our setting is interesting. The ban and its consequences, including the nationalization of Order property in Serbovia and possible attempts to get them back could be a point of contention. Serbovian citizens are legally banned from joining foreign military forces, but it would be fun if the Order acted as a sort of refuge for the occasional expatriate or descendants of expats, Foreign Legion-style.

3) The Order of St. Dorde, a Medieval establishment that likely took part in the Crusades at some point. Later in history becoming a secularized national order of honor, it was abolished in 1937 by the military junta for its association with the now-exiled monarchy. There is likely a remnant closely associated with the House of Dimitrovic.
 
  • Fourth-ing(?) the badass.
  • Templars likely would've had occasional bases in Jozefania intermittently, but due to constant conflict with the Elfriki Federation up to the end of the Great War, these would probably have been forcibly confiscated, maybe granted back afterwards, then confiscated again. Under the Mezhists and later Mazovists, there would've likely essentially been a particularly brutal purge and looting. It is possible for nowadays there to be Templars in the major cities of the Rzeczpospolita (its capital and the three realm capitals), but unlikely to be more than that.
  • As of now, I tentatively have planned a Sovereign Apostolic Order of the Holy Sword (name WIP) to have been established in 1668, two years after the Deluge, created as a permanent military-religious institution charged with the defence of the Rzeczpospolita's borders, the protection of the Apostolic Faith within its territories, and the maintenance of a body of trained knights available to the Crown at all times. There coooooooould be accusations that it's a super sneaky front for the Templars, whether or not that ends up true can be determined later.
 
1) Fifthing the badass. Let's extend the English vocabulary :cool:

2) Initially, I was thinking that you were asking whether parts of our countries were governed by a Knights Templar order, but it actually refers to groups of Knights Templar active in our countries ;) I can imagine that there are, but probably not in the Protestant parts of my country. One of my memberstates is a Prince-Bishopric; it could be that there is a Templar Province in Heilbach. It could also be that there are Templar Provinces in predominantly Catholic cities, for instance Cöllen, Weissenfels, Würzwald, Mainbad, Lörrach or Neckarbrück.

3) I need to flesh the knight orders out.
 
Eiffelland said:
1) Fifthing the badass. Let's extend the English vocabulary :cool:

2) Initially, I was thinking that you were asking whether parts of our countries were governed by a Knights Templar order, but it actually refers to groups of Knights Templar active in our countries ;) I can imagine that there are, but probably not in the Protestant parts of my country. One of my memberstates is a Prince-Bishopric; it could be that there is a Templar Province in Heilbach. It could also be that there are Templar Provinces in predominantly Catholic cities, for instance Cöllen, Weissenfels, Würzwald, Mainbad, Lörrach or Neckarbrück.

3) I need to flesh the knight orders out.
Click to expand...

Sorry about that. I should've clarified that a Province was an internal term for how they administered their affairs (admittedly at the provincial level, yes), rather than literally running it like a regional government!
 
So the greening of Nicosia got me thinking today. And I once again got thinking about Orders...

Specifically, I was informed that the Holy Land was a Radilo project before going inactive. And I was wondering about what its status is today.

Because I was thinking that, if possible, the Templar HQ should probably be based on the Temple Mount. Just taking in recruits from the surrounding areas, maybe being involved with local politics.

But otherwise, its footprint is in its many provinces across Europe.

If that doesn't jive with the current Terra Sancta project, I could always just put them on that tiny little island west of Nicosia, kind of like Limassol and whatnot.

Anyone know who I should be talking to about this?
 
Elfríki said:
So the greening of Nicosia got me thinking today. And I once again got thinking about Orders...
Click to expand...
Just an FYI, if you'd like any selected reading suggestions on the history and/or structure of orders let me know. My autism on the subject mainly is dedicated to the Knights of St. John but I have accumulated quite the library.
 
Lichtenau said:
Just an FYI, if you'd like any selected reading suggestions on the history and/or structure of orders let me know. My autism on the subject mainly is dedicated to the Knights of St. John but I have accumulated quite the library.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty scratched for time until November because I'm trying to finish a novel, but I'd love to know some handy beginner material for future reference.
 
Elfríki said:
Excellent. So is it any of your listed states, or would you say it was in Heilbach specifically?
Click to expand...
It depends. If you want them to be an order with close ties to the Tiburan Catholic Church, you can put them in Heilbach. If you want to give them some mysterious vibes, you could opt for a castle in the mountains of Southern Eiffelland, i.e. Tirolstein, Stolzenau, Wörgl or the South of Spessart. Or maybe you want to hide under the eyes of everybody and reside in a villa in Würzwald.
 
Elfríki said:
I'm pretty scratched for time until November because I'm trying to finish a novel, but I'd love to know some handy beginner material for future reference.
Click to expand...

Even though it is not Templar focused, I highly suggest The Last of the Crusaders by Roderick Cavaliero. This is a really good look into how an order had to adapt to changing times- not just in the context of losing the holy land. But rather how finances adapted to the reformation, shrinking numbers of joiners, and political challenges.

Next there are two books by Michael Haag. The Templars: the History & the Myth and The Tragedy of the Templars. The former provides really good understanding of structure, history, and expansion. The latter provides a lot more in terms of politics both internal and external.

Last, is The Military Orders: On Land and By Sea edited by Judi Upton Ward. This is a series of academic works by various scholars on the crusading orders. It covers everything from reputation to money management to competition between the orders. A bit more advanced but really good if you are trying to get serious detail on the character of an order.
 
Eiffelland said:
It depends. If you want them to be an order with close ties to the Tiburan Catholic Church, you can put them in Heilbach. If you want to give them some mysterious vibes, you could opt for a castle in the mountains of Southern Eiffelland, i.e. Tirolstein, Stolzenau, Wörgl or the South of Spessart. Or maybe you want to hide under the eyes of everybody and reside in a villa in Würzwald.
Click to expand...

Ooh, that's a lot of tempting options...

Lichtenau said:
Even though it is not Templar focused, I highly suggest The Last of the Crusaders by Roderick Cavaliero. This is a really good look into how an order had to adapt to changing times- not just in the context of losing the holy land. But rather how finances adapted to the reformation, shrinking numbers of joiners, and political challenges.

Next there are two books by Michael Haag. The Templars: the History & the Myth and The Tragedy of the Templars. The former provides really good understanding of structure, history, and expansion. The latter provides a lot more in terms of politics both internal and external.

Last, is The Military Orders: On Land and By Sea edited by Judi Upton Ward. This is a series of academic works by various scholars on the crusading orders. It covers everything from reputation to money management to competition between the orders. A bit more advanced but really good if you are trying to get serious detail on the character of an order.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the references! I'll keep an eye out for them.
 
By the way, you could also go for the swamps and lakes in the North of Wetterau and the South of Emsland. That is a peat area; the lakes are the result of massive peat extraction in the past. One caveat: That area is heavily under the influence of Protestantism.
 
I've lost count, but I support this of course.

Like IRL, the Knights Hospitalier would've ruled Rhodokastellon island and perhaps some of the adjoining ports on the mainland, until these were retaken by the Empire gradually between the 13th and 17th centuries.

The Templars would have also had bases in crusader states set up in what is today southeastern Pelasgia, though, again these would have been suppressed by the 17th century at the latest (probably earlier).

A good chunk of the Archipelago (basically the islands off northwest and western Pelasgia) was not retaken until the 19th century (indeed, the Archipelago Wars went into the 20th century), so perhaps the Templars could've stuck around longer - and, today, the Knights Hospitalier may still have charitable missions in the islands, for the local significant Catholic minority.

----

Not sure if the Varangians count, but they're definitely still a thing, and will show up in my next RP post ;)
 
Oh, looking forward to reading that, of course.

The history also provides a lot of great context for the Templars and Hospitalers. I suppose I could figure something out for the charity missions.

Also, on the assumption that @Lucania still funds the Papacy like Ebria did, I'm guessing they definitely have a province in Tibur?
 
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