OOC Thread: Energex & ARPEE

[Józefania]

So, with Tyran's announced departure (and to my understanding the Tiburan Union's temporarily break from RP), we need to retcon and/or rethink the creation of both the Energex Strategic Consortium and the Association of Resolute Petroleum and Energy Exporters.

I think the very first question that needs to be answered is the following: Does Energex still work without Tyran providing the backbone of it? Is it as simple as Azilia slotting in and, if so, what is the motivation? Perhaps establishing control over the Meridian Sea as a major chokepoint in the global trade network? Would Azilia remain strictly regional in this regard or would they be willing to be more global in its reach?

Only after that is answered should we then ask: does ARPEE still work as, essentially, a reaction to Energex?

@Azilia @Eiffelland @Nandao @Nanuka @Pelasgia @Petits-Pays @Ranrike @Sylvania @The Konderland @YUANGUO

 

[Pelasgia]

The thing about Energex is that its whole purpose and structure was unclear and seemingly fluid. The conference to agree to it never actually established what it was about, other than generally somehow dictating the fate of the world (at least as far as I could understand--the RP was dropped halfway through and didn't progress much). The wording of the draft finally agreed to made it seem like a simple discussion forum to encourage mutual investments in energy infrastructure, but the way in which Tyran treated it IC, especially in character RP, made it seem like it was a massive cross between a mega-cartel and transnational public-private partnership conglomerate controlling half of NSE's oil and natural gas. It also gradually grew to entail geopolitical dimensions, which, with Tyran, Azilia and Cervia-Meridia/TU's coordination surrounding Matambaland put Pelasgia on alarm at the prospect of being surrounded by three (or at least two) powers that seemed to be coordinating without it, and drove Propontis into the arms of ARPEE.

With Tyran out of the picture and with TU on pause, all of sudden those designs and the geopolitical considerations they generated seem... non-existent? The logic underlying Energex no longer seems to make sense. Is there a giant super-state both north of Media and between Media and Himyar to pressure the others in the region into an oil cartel? No. Without that, is there anyone even in a position to monopolize oil and natural gas in the region? No, because production (Pelasgia and Azilia in the colonies) and distribution (Tyran and Cervia-Meridia) are no longer united in one bloc, and cannot be, because the entire distribution part is gone. No one can even geographically connect those regions, like Tyran could. OK so there's no reason for other countries to be scared into creating ARPEE. So, in short, there's no underlying logic to any of this, and I think we can confidently say Energex would have never happened without Tyran, let alone without Tyran and Cervia-Meridia. And without Energex, ARPEE would've never happened.

It did happen, but with Tyran greened and with TU gone for an undetermined amount of time, I guess we can all agree to retcon it? I know ppl might be opposed to retcons, but the treaty was never even signed (probably because of the lack of clarity about what Energex ultimately was), so ironically ARPEE advanced further than Tyran, and even so, neither actually generated any RP. Not to sound harsh, but I don't think our RP would meaningfully change if we just shelved the whole storyline.

 

[Azilia]

Thats what in private I had discussed that Azilia if on a need be basis would be willing to take on the mantle as having formed something along the lines of what energex is, albeit modified slightly from what the treaty was to something a bit more fitting.

It doesn't leave a big gaping hole in role-play, it just changes dynamics a bit where some things that might have come to be don't come about (namely Energex and ARPEE). While it changes some aspects for me, it doesn't drastically change anything, as I was gradually rolling out stuff one nation at a time, all it did was remove 2 pieces from the chessboard (potentially), while potentially allowing multiple new pieces to fall into place.

 

[Averin]

I say just dump the whole ARPEE/ENERGEX RP as it stands and lets go on with pretending Tyran never existed.

 

[Tiburan Union]

I just want to say, just for the sake of fairness, that I was not part of energex. I was an Energex customer as I bought from them. (The magic of geography) Never RP'd to get in as a member, Once again, I was a consumer, not a producer or distributor. (Look the map, I don't have gas or oil. You just blamed one your your customers)

I don't even know why I'm mentioned so many times in the pelasgian reply. I'm not even in the matambaland RP because kondelrand never responded to me (I didn't blame him for it.). I said it my last post with arzialia, that I don't care about matambaland (RP).

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[Pelasgia]

I just want to say, just for the sake of fairness, that I was not part of energex. I was an Energex customer as I bought from them. (The magic of geography) Never RP'd to get in as a member, Once again, I was a consumer, not a producer or distributor. (Look the map, I don't have gas or oil. You just blamed one your your customers)

Well, since Energex never really came into being I'm not sure who you bought from. Pelasgia and Meridia already had an agreement in place, Tyran including TU in its planning independently of that is a whole other thing. Pelasgia did sell to (half?) the TU, but as Pelasgia, not as Energex, since it never signed the agreement.

I don't even know why I'm mentioned so many times in the pelasgian reply.

Because the geography doesn't work without you. So you are a customer, yes, but the oil has to flow through you to reach big parts of the target market efficiently. The maps shared privately in planning made that more clear, but I don't want to publicise DMs.

I'm not even in the matambaland RP because kondelrand never responded to me (I didn't blame him for it.). I said it my last post with arzialia, that I don't care about matambaland (RP).

My activity on this forum is pretty sporadic, so apologies for any confusion, but from what I gleamed over time, there seemed to be interest in more active involvement. Maybe I misinterpreted that.

 

[Nanuka]

Sorry for being sort of absent lately, I just finished a move into a new apartment so I've been preoccupied. Anyway these developments are pretty disappointing.

I will say that ARPEE is a huge, huge win for Nanuka. I've RP'd Nanuka's economy as slightly diversified, but all of its over-the-top government spending to support a social safety net that makes people more okay with accepting an illiberal society is all funded by petrol sales. Nanuka being able to get huge swaths of the petrol states into an association that works to standardize prices is very, very valuable to Nanuka. Further, having that organization based in Nanuka allows me to exert a huge amount of influence over it that Nanuka never would be able to otherwise. Nanuka being a less-than-stand-up actor with ARPEE was going to be a big piece of my RP moving forward. Nanuka constantly punching above its grade its the cornerstone of my rp lol.

Still, I am aware of the fact it likely wouldn't have been possible to get the nations to sign ARPEE without the looming threat of Energex. Particularly, I know Sylvania's reluctance to sign multi-nation agreements. So I want to be cognizant that the "cause" of ARPEE's founding is gone while also advocating that ~I~ still plan to make it interesting.

Ultimately, I won't rage quit if Energex and ARPEE are tanked. I agree that, as in the past when nations leave, they should be greened and the world pretend they don't exist. I am simply saying, as Nanuka has always said, gib aid :3

 

[Pelasgia]

Sorry for being sort of absent lately, I just finished a move into a new apartment so I've been preoccupied. Anyway these developments are pretty disappointing.

I will say that ARPEE is a huge, huge win for Nanuka. I've RP'd Nanuka's economy as slightly diversified, but all of its over-the-top government spending to support a social safety net that makes people more okay with accepting an illiberal society is all funded by petrol sales. Nanuka being able to get huge swaths of the petrol states into an association that works to standardize prices is very, very valuable to Nanuka. Further, having that organization based in Nanuka allows me to exert a huge amount of influence over it that Nanuka never would be able to otherwise. Nanuka being a less-than-stand-up actor with ARPEE was going to be a big piece of my RP moving forward. Nanuka constantly punching above its grade its the cornerstone of my rp lol.

Still, I am aware of the fact it likely wouldn't have been possible to get the nations to sign ARPEE without the looming threat of Energex. Particularly, I know Sylvania's reluctance to sign multi-nation agreements. So I want to be cognizant that the "cause" of ARPEE's founding is gone while also advocating that ~I~ still plan to make it interesting.

Ultimately, I won't rage quit if Energex and ARPEE are tanked. I agree that, as in the past when nations leave, they should be greened and the world pretend they don't exist. I am simply saying, as Nanuka has always said, gib aid :3

I mean, we could always form an OPEC style body, and not everyone needs to join (e.g., the US is not in OPEC). It just doesn't need to have the structure and geopolitical goals of Energex.

It could be as simple as one producer messaging all the other and recommending a cartel. I don't mind being the one doing that, if people need someone to take the PR L. Or Nanuka can do it since it's such a huge producer of oil as well.

 

[YUANGUO]

I'm in favour of any proposal that would see both ENERGEX and ARPEE existing. I'm very interested in Tyran continuing in some form, perhaps limited to the core of what made Tyran, Tyran. If Tyran is cleared out, then I will have to reorganise my rp within this area, including the geostrategy of the Pearl Route, Yuan being a major client of ENERGEX, and the close links between Tyran and Yuan with the Nya Borgvik CMZ.

Looking at Yuan, it is very much tied closely to Tyran. Now, whether or not this would mean that we are past the rubicon, that we cannot retcon or etc, I have no idea. But, what I can say is that whatever the case, we should keep ENERGEX and ARPEE in their natural forms as oil cartels, and not throw away this very good piece of storyline. Anyhow, at the end of the day, I leave it to the powers that be, to see how we should move forward in light of these new disappointing circumstances.

Given my priorities at the moment, I will not be able to rp for some time, almost until december. SO, toodaloo!
: )

 

[Averin]

im fine with keeping it as is, but of course someone needs to take over Tyran in a limited capacity and the spot needs to be reduced to perhaps just bordering the Meridian and such. otherwise its just a dead spot that exists to keep someone's stories together.

 

[Józefania]

I, personally, would be supportive of keeping Energex and/or ARPEE (or a third option that essentially combines the two into a notOPEC) around if there's a sufficient retconned timeline we can come up with. I'm intrigued to see what Azilia would propose in that regard and if the other Energex nations would be ok with it, or if not, if they'd propose ARPEE to Nanuka and company as a response.

As for Tyran, while I understand that Yuan devoted a lot of past and present RP to bilateral and multilateral interactions with the player, I'm of the strong opinion that it must be greened completely, as well as the Tiburan Union (with the news that they're leaving as well.)

 

[Azilia]

I shall do a tiny bit of thinking on some various ways of keeping something of an energex around to keep to ARPEE around, but I am as well indifferent if that part of history was to just be as if it did not happen I am okay with that too. Wouldn't be hard to see the foundations of something come about all over again, might be hard to get some of the nations that did sign on sign onto it again.

as far as the greening, I would say green away, prime real estate available. beach front property for sale.

 

[Eiffelland]

I will follow suit with whatever is decided.

 

[Azilia]

So as I mulled it over and have thought about it a bit more, contemplating various things, and the gaping hole that is now the continent......I don't know that Azilia and its politics, and given Pelasgia and its politics, I don't think there would be any true real way for Azilia to have done anything of similarity to ENERGEX. Especially as seeing that it is only a natural gas producer, and the idea of Energex was bringing them all together, which is in same way what ARPEE drew upon.

That and the change in the geopolitical landscape, where it had only thrown itself into the Tyranian camp because of the resource access and the advantage of the entire bloc controlling all entry-ways into the Meridian was appealing to the Caudillo, but he was still getting extractions out of Tyran for throwing Azilia into its camp.