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Eilezia

Eilezia

Joined
Mar 1, 2016
Messages
47
Location
Italy - Foggia
Capital
Philadon
Propontine Empire said:
I might have erroneous information but if I remember correctly the Fascists were quite successful at nearly eradicating the Mafia, under some "iron prefect" guy. Then the yanks brought them over again to help the control southern Italy post WWII. If I also remember correctly after unification the new King and gov't went back on promises of industrialisation and land redistribution for the South, allowing landlords to stay in power while doing nothing to bring modernisation to the Mezzogiorno (I hope I didn't butcher that), which resulted in mass migrations, brigandry and the whole Mafia story.

The Junta actually is the source of most of Greece's current problems. Before the Junta, even with the massive loss of the Left in the Civil War, a sort of reconciliation and political stability had been reached. The Palace stayed out of most public affairs in exchange for mainting ceremonial authority, the left was allowed to take part in elections etc. as the United Democratic Left (EDA; KKE was officially prohibited under heavy US influence and to stabilise the country, so it's social-democrat facade as EDA was tolerated to bring stability), the military stayed out of gov't affairs, economic development under US help was going pretty well (even though the US helped Germany to avoid paying us reparations and sheltered many collaborators, particularly wealthy businessmen, industralists etc. in exchange for Cold War support) and we were on our way to join the EEC as one of the earliest members without having to fake any financial data since we were doing just fine. Cyprus was almost entirely Greek and on its way to inevitably join Greece via referendum in the foreseeable future (which is why Turkey started breaching the Treaty of Lausanne and evicting Greek populations in Imbros, Tenedos and Constantinople). The Junta destroyed any political balance, brought complete international isolation upon us (which would bite us in the ass in Cyprus), turned Greece into a US puppet state, kicked out many great scientists and intellectuals, held our education decades back (especially by its practical worship of Byzantium and Katharevousa and its hatred for Clacissism and Demotic) and plunged our economy into debt, at the benefit of the shipping magnates and industrialists (who were practically releieved of all taxation - it was in this decade that Greek shipping magnates solidified their dominance over world maritime trade). Even after its fall, many of our greatest progressive leaders were dead and many were killed in the decades after by right wing governments using the apparatus the Junta had created. The Junta tolerated and encouraged corruption, while it made us see the State as an enemy and created mistrust between citizens and gov't (something the carries on to this day). The domiannt cliques that propped the Junta up continue to be in power (hence why most of the burden of the recession is falling of the lower and former middle class, not the magnates and industrialists who caused it in the first place). There is a lack of capable leadership since most of it is either six feet under or without influence and nobody would ever dare tax the upper classes. Additionally many of the WWII collborationists and their descendants who were involved in recent scandals with foreign companies such as Siemens are left unpunished, the effects of the Junta's corruption are still quite rampant, Greece's population was reduced by migration, our foreign policy is in shumbles, our academic institutions are ruined and our economy is even worse, while political polarisation is still very apparent, just like in post-Franco Spain, unilke the rest of Western Europe. The Junta is probably the worst thing to have happened to Greece in a long time, if not ever, I would be willing to have the Gluksburg monarchy still as a ceremonial institution if it meant not having the Junta. Then again if the Junta never occured, the Gluksburgs would have been sent away eventuall, well before my birth.
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Your information is right. As any other totalitarianism, fascism couldn't tolerate second or third authorities wielding their power against or alongside its own in its territory. And mafia was, and is, a state within the state, which means an abomination in the eyes of Mussolini and his minions. But how he eradicated this poisonous plant (which grew again soon after his fall) is the very meaningful fact: he achieved the goal by standing above the law and denying even the simplest right, just like only a dictatorship might do it. Long story short, Mussolini entrusted Cesare Mori, a legal officer, with the challenging task of wiping away from Sicily all the local connections involving the mafia and banditism and gave him the power to do everything was necessary to accomplish this task. And mr. Mori really made the most of this complete authority, ignoring the basic legal procedures and regulations (however negatively we want to consider them during the fascism). Just to give two examples: he started his mission by sieging a whole village of 15.000 inhabitants and used to get judges deliver verdicts of guilty for crimes committed the same day, at the same hour by people living hundreds of kilometres away. Those years Sicily was like the far-west and not only because the landscape there is similar to those seen in the western movies. His method was so "forward" that even Mussolini himself had to relieve Mori from his charge. At the end we had a temporary solution and without touching local mafia in parts of southern Italy other than Sicily. It goes without saying that nowadays a similar strategy would be impossible to carry out. As for the origins of Mafia, it started before the unification of Italy but it's true that this event boosted it because officials from the old Kingdom of Sardinia were sent everywhere in southern Italy and they knew anything about the territories they had to govern. So local criminals/politicians used the mistrust and the lack of effective power to their advantage.

I am realizing that my comment could seem like a defence for the Junta...might my people of Eilezia be devoured by the sea if I meant something like that :p I was just wondering about the difference of privileges between the Junta and the current politicians/high officials in Greece (at least before the crisis), no matter if we see the dictatorship as a source of the current situation.
Thanks for this brief story/analysis about that period of your history and its consequences! It's already a big thing if we spend few words about it at school here in Italy (at least until I was there).

Propontine Empire said:
Indeed. The EU is a Union without any united spirit or leadership. As long as we all feel Greek, Italian, Polish, German etc. first and European second, we will never unite and we will indefinately remain a mere extension of US influence. If we are to unite we must look for the good of Europe first and our country second, much like the Americans look out for their entire country (poor states included) and their local area second. If not we're nothing more than a hyper-advanced cartel.

It is. BTW Thessalonica is getting its own, but they've been working at it for quite a while and it's not goin got finish before 2020 at this rate. Lack of industrialisation does that. Thanks Junta!
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Totally agree with you. But now I have to leave you and go to raise up a walled border between me and my neighbour!
 
Eilezia

Eilezia

Joined
Mar 1, 2016
Messages
47
Location
Italy - Foggia
Capital
Philadon
Propontine Empire said:
Welcome, mon ami! You'll love it here! I think most of us don't have pets, which is why we treat our citizens as such (maybe it's only me). It feels good to have another High School kid around, I was getting lonely XD
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I'm shocked more than that time when I discovered you can get a sunburn in Lapland! I've pictured you as a 30-40 years old guy, maybe starting to have his first grey hairs :D
 
Bolonesvia

Bolonesvia

Joined
Apr 14, 2016
Messages
67
Capital
Reigenstadt
Hey, I'm Nick, from the North-east USA. I'm an IR major German Minor who is going to study abroad in January.

My country is called Bolonesvia, I made it when I was in like, 6th grade? I just remembered this game.
 
Aynu-mosir

Aynu-mosir

Joined
Apr 14, 2016
Messages
8
Location
USA
Capital
Nontenay-kotan
Nick
Aynu
Hi! I'm Brenden from the USA. I'm a history student. My nation is based off of the Ainu people of northern Japan and Sakhalin.
 
Pelasgia

Pelasgia

Established Nation
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
4,285
Location
Athens, Greece
Nick
Demos
Eilezia said:
I'm shocked more than that time when I discovered you can get a sunburn in Lapland! I've pictured you as a 30-40 years old guy, maybe starting to have his first grey hairs :D
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HAHAHAHAHAHA I guess I'm mature for my age? :smug:

Bolonesvia said:
Hey, I'm Nick, from the North-east USA. I'm an IR major German Minor who is going to study abroad in January.

My country is called Bolonesvia, I made it when I was in like, 6th grade? I just remembered this game.
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Welcome! I'm kinda confused are you German or American?

Aynu-mosir said:
Hi! I'm Brenden from the USA. I'm a history student. My nation is based off of the Ainu people of northern Japan and Sakhalin.
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Wow, that's probably the most original nation I've seen so far. Welcome!
 
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Aynu-mosir

Aynu-mosir

Joined
Apr 14, 2016
Messages
8
Location
USA
Capital
Nontenay-kotan
Nick
Aynu
Propontine Empire said:
HAHAHAHAHAHA I guess I'm mature for my age? :smug:


Welcome! I'm kinda confused are you German or American?


Wow, that's probably the most original nation I've seen so far. Welcome!
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Not sure if it's going to work, now that I can see the map. Everything in NE "Asia" region is occupied by the Anti-State. What's up with that?
 
Pelasgia

Pelasgia

Established Nation
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
4,285
Location
Athens, Greece
Nick
Demos
Aynu-mosir said:
Not sure if it's going to work, now that I can see the map. Everything in NE "Asia" region is occupied by the Anti-State. What's up with that?
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It's a NPC space-filler that never posts. You should contact the admins, they'll almost certainly let you grab a chunk.
 
Eilezia

Eilezia

Joined
Mar 1, 2016
Messages
47
Location
Italy - Foggia
Capital
Philadon
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and Aynu-mosir: welcome and have a great time here!
Propontine Empire said:
HAHAHAHAHAHA I guess I'm mature for my age? :smug:
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Well, I'm less mature than I should be so it's an offsetting thing I guess ahahah
By the way, the embargo I talked about in our diplo didn't have to do with your empire :p
 
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