Challenge to Pelasgian Colony

[Thaumantica]

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Location: Picture above
Name of Country: Esperian Islands (Pelasgia)
Capital City: Neolcis
Location of Capital City: Picture above
Additional Major Cities (Max 2): N/A
Additional Minor Cities (Max 3): N/A
Miscellaneous:

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I'd like to make a colony application for a little thing I've been building towards in my RP. Comments are always welcome, it's a minor storyline so if people are really against it I don't mind greening it.

Otherwise, I intend to continue developing it.

I want to block this claim, not as an admin ruling, but as a challenge any other player might do and converse about with the claimant and others. There have been many nation changes special to your account over the last years and while a colony might expand your potential or RP, a very specific uranium rich one is necessarily controversial.

Before this comes personal and negative: through iterations of Pelasgia I think you have written several amazing IC threads I have read, your news threads are always logical and well constructed, but then the nation drops off and is changed. We can gloss over this through imagineering that a new regime pops up in that Meridian territory OOC, and re-assume it always existed IC. But with WMDs well accepted as being on the table again you're player there with uranium - and about a month ago you were debating whether or not to be aggro-on or aggro-off from circumstances and changing your mind about that.

We last RP'd with Pelasgia together when it was Communist Pelasgia about a year ago so OOC I'd love to make a nice uranium ring deal with this new colony, but I think it has then experienced two major nation rebuild changes? I think this is a potentially dumb and dangerous claim for you.

Sorry for being harsh Demos.

 

[Touzen]

Being vaguely in the area, I have no strong feelings regarding this one way or the other. The uranium might look sus on paper, but I’m going to trust Demos that he has good RP-conductive reasons to frame the request the way he did.

Hopefully you can find a good solution together.

 

[Tarusa]

My .02

Part of me had the prediction that, nuclear weapons being re-introduced would bring about another race for nuclear weapons. Cause while in theory they are in the real world only in limited hands, the reality of it truthfully is.....any nation with a nuclear power plant can make even the most basic of bombs (gun-type), so the resource now all of a sudden has an implication beyond just an economic one. I would say that should make Uranium a strategic resource of similarity to oil (if not greater than it).

What does such mean in my eyes?

Many know, I am always one that doesn't like nation changing (I like continuity) and I don't particularly care for growing pixels by the OOC means (but I also know sometimes there are just OOC reasons to allow it, smoother borders to make two nations claims fit together to eliminate small spaces that would never be claimed, player has shown commitment and dedication etc vs when they were new so we give some leeway, etc etc just many reasons). Im a believer IC growth of a nation tis the way to go. Want to expand? Go take it by force or some other cleverness, being a colonial power means sometimes your gonna have to take the hit and be a bad guy, if you don't want to be the bad guy, maybe expanding wasn't for you after-all.

I like Demos, I like everyone here, we all have our differences of opinions and thats okay. The Rp Demos does is great, I enjoy it.....he is and his Rp is what gave me some inspiration towards the Rp I have thought of in attempting the new EF as a way to allow him to broaden his style into another location.

Now that brings me back to my own .02, I personally would have to agree with Thaumantica on it. Not because of the who, but because of the underlying reasons behind it. I see it as another strategic resource, and I personally do not think we should expand claims to colonies/strategic resources without some very heavy scrutiny of it (personally I'd say at all, it should always be part of a new nation claim). The other reason being that it was only a few months ago we had a series of pixel squeezes OOCly, it was like an all you can eat buffet, and I know I had jokingly said something about it, as had others and coro had brought up that we/he/someone would/should tighten down on the OOC pixel maneuvers.

 

[Remuria]

I welcome the removal of additional fairy dragon pixels.

 

[Imimoya]

Hello I'm here with the rules

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That said, no personal problems. However, remember that the claim of a fundamental resource like that will bring you attention that I don't think you have considered.

 

[Jydsken-Østveg]

We had all spoken on the issue of Mompracem on the discord not long ago, and we seemed to be in favor of greening it rather than just converting it to a new colonial papa. I believe that was due to similar issues as this Pelasgian application. I appreciate the discussion on the issue, and would like to note that the community decision on this will impact what happens with Mompracem as well.

 

[Imimoya]

We had all spoken on the issue of Mompracem on the discord not long ago, and we seemed to be in favor of greening it rather than just converting it to a new colonial papa. I believe that was due to similar issues as this Pelasgian application. I appreciate the discussion on the issue, and would like to note that the community decision on this will impact what happens with Mompracem as well.

I don't think mompracem is an example to consider, 90% of the conversation was insults. Without considering that on that occasion my final desire to leave the island to the federation that had requested it was ignored.

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Having said that, I do not object to Pelasgia's request for the topics listed above. Even if personally the expansions through the claims on the map topic hurt my soul. I prefer a more concrete and, if we want to define it, explorer system. You want an island/no man's land, go and colonize, by force of arms. But expect armed resistance.

 

[Touzen]

I guess that’s too gamey/“competitive” for my feel, but I understand that there are different opinions regarding this topic (see the war dice that divide people firmly into camps based on which aspect of the forum they care more about).

 

[Jydsken-Østveg]

Maybe I should just disallow colonies with the exception of a yearly "pixelfest" in which everyone can request all their colonies during that one period of time yearly :3

 

[Tarusa]

Maybe an alternative to having many colonies (with exception of new new nations being formed and having it as part of their initial claim), we make a series of NPC states? Not a bunch but just some for each continent of varying sizes/degree?

Like the blank pixels between Revy and I we have discussed possibility of it being an NPC where we have historically played a “great game” between the two of us. We still haven’t figured out 100% of any ideas but just spitballed some stuff back and forth.

 

[Imimoya]

all of you are looking at the problem from the wrong side.

the question we should ask ourselves is; What is unclaimed land? Nations? Wildlands? Another forum I was on before had its own explanation for this dilemma.

 

[Touzen]

Ultimately that’s the sort of verisimilitude issue we just have to accept as part of the premise I feel. Similar to how we don’t have any truly exploited global south that can make our global exploitation conspiracy work.

 

[Remuria]

Like the blank pixels between Revy and I we have discussed possibility of it being an NPC where we have historically played a “great game” between the two of us. We still haven’t figured out 100% of any ideas but just spitballed some stuff back and forth.

Yes, I welcome the removal of these fairy pixels as well, great idea

 

[Pelasgia]

Thanks everyone for the feedback, appreciate and I think it's all fair.

@Thaumantica Generally speaking, I think your concern is very valid and fair. No offence taken at all. Also @Tianlong I also think you make a good point regarding unwanted attention.

@Tarusa I actually was thinking of originally RPing that Pelasgia would go and aggressively conquer the islands instead of having colonized them previously, but I don't feel I have the energy for that, which I think means I don't have the energy for the colony in general. The RP posts in question don't actually specify whether it's a newly colonized island or not (

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,

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,

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).

I can trash the storyline or I can shift it to another location without a strategic resource (perhaps the OG Far South?). The question then arises as to why Pelasgia would go through the trouble of colonizing that, but that's another issue. Maybe some resource-less island has a good position for trade.

Yes, I welcome the removal of these fairy pixels as well, great idea

I actually think NPC states are a great idea. It also means we can just say we get the resources they occupy by trade. E.g., what I had done with Central Himyar before my intervention there. And if a new player wants, they can take over the territory.

 

[Pelasgia]

I like Demos, I like everyone here, we all have our differences of opinions and thats okay. The Rp Demos does is great, I enjoy it.....he is and his Rp is what gave me some inspiration towards the Rp I have thought of in attempting the new EF as a way to allow him to broaden his style into another location.

PS: Appreciate this. Ik it's unrelated, but I'm curious to see how the new EF will play out.

Also, if everyone is OK with it, my thinking is for Pelasgia to try to settle these islands through the PFSC instead:

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The location is useful for maritime trade, which is Pelasgia's top industry, so it would justify the endeavour by an ambitious PFSC exec acting as Propontis' long arm, but it would also not be a strategic resource. Given the RL history of the equivalent area, it's likely that the islands will be unpopulated, but I instead want to a RP a unique, made-up native culture as existing there instead, as with the previous version of the Far South.

Basically, the PFSC would show up one day and "set up" the small settlements seen on the map, trying to force the locals into a protectorate by taking advantage of internal divisions.

Thoughts on this?

 

[Josepania]

What could be an interesting solution (that'll require a LOT of initial work) is doing away with the entire concept of "blank map space" and instead having it all be, essentially, NPCs. For new players or completely new nations they'd have the most ease in "replacing" these NPCs with their own concepts and carving them up, but this would also drastically reduce excessive colonial claims, potentially create excellent RP opportunities re: wars of expansion etc. like @Tarusa was talking about, make the map look better in general.

It'd probably require a massive community effort to create these NPCs to say nothing of what @Jydsken-Østveg would need to do to map them, but I think this is worth considering as a long-term solution solving a lot of old problems that have kept popping up.

 

[Imimoya]

What could be an interesting solution (that'll require a LOT of initial work) is doing away with the entire concept of "blank map space" and instead having it all be, essentially, NPCs. For new players or completely new nations they'd have the most ease in "replacing" these NPCs with their own concepts and carving them up, but this would also drastically reduce excessive colonial claims, potentially create excellent RP opportunities re: wars of expansion etc. like @Tarusa was talking about, make the map look better in general.

It'd probably require a massive community effort to create these NPCs to say nothing of what @Jydsken-Østveg would need to do to map them, but I think this is worth considering as a long-term solution solving a lot of old problems that have kept popping up.

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[Pelasgia]

What could be an interesting solution (that'll require a LOT of initial work) is doing away with the entire concept of "blank map space" and instead having it all be, essentially, NPCs. For new players or completely new nations they'd have the most ease in "replacing" these NPCs with their own concepts and carving them up, but this would also drastically reduce excessive colonial claims, potentially create excellent RP opportunities re: wars of expansion etc. like @Tarusa was talking about, make the map look better in general.

It'd probably require a massive community effort to create these NPCs to say nothing of what @Jydsken-Østveg would need to do to map them, but I think this is worth considering as a long-term solution solving a lot of old problems that have kept popping up.

I volunteer for NPC creation. In case people haven't noticed, I like writing factbooks. And making flags.

 

[The Federation]

, but this would also drastically reduce excessive colonial claims, potentially create excellent RP opportunities re: wars of expansion etc. like @Tarusa was talking about, make the map look better in general.

This right here is why we shouldn't do this. It's so lame to see npc's getting gobbled up because people don't want to do war rp's with other real players.

 

[Tarusa]

This right here is why we shouldn't do this. It's so lame to see npc's getting gobbled up because people don't want to do war rp's with other real players.

Tis why I’m against the colonial expansions by claims thing. Like I don’t mind being the bad guy (I’m the hero in my own story, you all are the villains!), but seeing expansions done by just claiming another blank space just makes me

my own idea of NPC wasn’t primarily so much so to make it so there’s weak states that aren’t played, but a slight variety (not many, but enough to take up some blank spaces), with varying degrees of capability? Could be small bois, could be big bois that can obviously put up a fight and hold their own like most players nations. That was just a simple spitball.

I don’t like seeing all the open space, but I also don’t like changeritis, and not the fan of ever growing/evolving of nations coming via OOC means. Like zeek and some others, Tarusa tis pretty much the same it was from creation unless it was something IC that caused its growth.